US, UK, German Embassies attacked in Kosovo

[Sgt So and So]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7256158.stm

This doesn't bode well for the independence movement. I wonder what the international backlash will be.

[OliverMarshall]

US, UK and Croation; not German. The Serbian Army has 2008 as its big modernizing year so the military may be feeling pumped, it should blow over soon.

[Fallschirmjäger]

I see the police arrived half an hour i think after they did damage to the u.s embassy.I think the police did that on purpose you would think maybe.

[OliverMarshall]

international reaction:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7258153.stm

[Kaos]

Who gives a shit what the Serbs do.

If they didn't want Kosovo to secede they shouldn't have started slaughtering Albanians. But they did and the Kosovan-Albanians, the EU and NATO got pissed and this is the result. There's nothing they can do to stop it except invade and the government wouldn't do anything that stupid considering just about every country except for Spain, Russia and others with minority ethnic groups agitating for separation have supported the move.

[Oddvin]

Kosovo is Serbian territory and has been so for more or less the last 700 years. Whatever move they take against the Albanians i support it. It is their right to defend their own sovereign territory with any means possible. If the Albanians have such a hard time in Kosovo, then then they should go back to their own country!

[Fallschirmjäger]

But its there country too,as they where born there too,and have history there as well.And after what happened in the last war,dont see them doing more that what there doing now.Like maybe some are more hardline of course and may want to use weapons,but would be stopped or put down quickly i think.

And maybe they should have given the northern part where the serbs live to them as seperate country or add it too serbia,and all the serbs there could move there.Or they just live where they are and try to get on with the ethnic albanians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo_War


Kosovo Serb protesters attack UN police.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080222/ap_on_re_eu/serbia_kosovo

[Oddvin]

But its there country too,as they where born there too,and have history there as well.And after what happened in the last war,dont see them doing more that what there doing now.Like maybe some are more hardline of course and may want to use weapons,but would be stopped or put down quickly i think.

Do you have any friends from Kosovo then? Well, i do! I know several of them who are living there at this moment. And the Albanians are doing exactly what they have always done to the Serbs. They are doing serious crimes all the time. They rape, mob and kill Serbs. Remember, this is the Serbian states heartland. It has been so for the last 700 hundred years or so. And now because the Albanians swarm into Kosovo, and make it hell to live for the Serbs they get their independence? They out bred them. Albania is their country, whether they were born there or not makes no difference. It is not their country, they speak Albanian, keep their culture and tear down Serbian culture. Like churches. The Albanians have their country so they can fuck off to it, if they do not like living in Serbia.

This is written by a Serbian: http://baksiden.net/kosovo.htm

You are trying to tell me that the Albanians are the victims? Come on, you know better. It is a war of cultures, and since the world is blatantly blind for the injustice to the Serbians people, i really do hope they declare war and chease them back to Albania, where they belong.

[Corporate Ignorance]

Who gives a shit what the Serbs do.

If they didn't want Kosovo to secede they shouldn't have started slaughtering Albanians. But they did and the Kosovan-Albanians, the EU and NATO got pissed and this is the result. There's nothing they can do to stop it except invade and the government wouldn't do anything that stupid considering just about every country except for Spain, Russia and others with minority ethnic groups agitating for separation have supported the move.

Well, it's kind of double standarts...Within Nato itself, especially in early 90s happened terrible slaughter and opression- and I speak about Kurds and the repression of them in South-Eastern Turkey. And nobody gave a shit...America, the cheif military exporter to Turkey, just doubled the amounts of weapons in the worst year of the repressions...There were thousands of people driven out of their homes, thrown to jail without accusations, raped and murdered.
But it's not covered in the mainstream media. It's just forgotten. Because again, it does not fit.

What I want to say that we shouldn't take ANYTHING that big politicians say for granted,
They cheat. Oh, damn they cheat.
Just analzye the story of Rwandian genocide and you will get the right picture of what international law really is , and what moral big and powerful states have....
What is really behind all those talks about international justice, humanism, and European values of compassion.
About serbs...Well...Albanians slaughtered Serbs, Serbs under that maniac Milocevic slaughtered Albainians, and also NOONE remmebers the Genocide of Serbs in Kraina by Croats in 1994...Far more bloody. But noone remmebers it...

So, it's a very dirty political game once again.
I'm not advocating Serbs, I just want to point out that there is much lies and misinformation about Balkans. And the situation is being used by powerful nations in their geopolitical games.

[Kaos]

Do you have any friends from Kosovo then? Well, i do! I know several of them who are living there at this moment. And the Albanians are doing exactly what they have always done to the Serbs. They are doing serious crimes all the time. They rape, mob and kill Serbs. Remember, this is the Serbian states heartland. It has been so for the last 700 hundred years or so. And now because the Albanians swarm into Kosovo, and make it hell to live for the Serbs they get their independence? They out bred them. Albania is their country, whether they were born there or not makes no difference. It is not their country, they speak Albanian, keep their culture and tear down Serbian culture. Like churches. The Albanians have their country so they can fuck off to it, if they do not like living in Serbia.

This is written by a Serbian: http://baksiden.net/kosovo.htm

You are trying to tell me that the Albanians are the victims? Come on, you know better. It is a war of cultures, and since the world is blatantly blind for the injustice to the Serbians people, i really do hope they declare war and chease them back to Albania, where they belong.

No offense, but Serbs aren't likely to give a very balanced opinion of their Albanian neighbours are they? The vast, vast majority of Albanian's do not "Rape, mob and kill" Serbs. In fact, most of the crime in Serbian is committed by Serbs.

But that's not the point.

Albanian's have lived in the area now called Kosovo since the Bronze Age. They were the first settlers to that area. The Slavs, Serbs, Croats, Hungarians and Slovenes came later, around the 7th Century BC. They were part of the Byzantine empire. Since then we've had various Kingdoms (Kingdom of Serbia, Kingdom of Yugoslavia), The Socialist Republic, The Federated Republic and finally The Republic of Serbia. Under all of these Serbs, Bosniaks, Roma's, Yugoslavs, Slovenes and Albanians have lived together. For hundreds of years. It IS their country. In some cities Albanian's make up a majority - like Kosovo, Presevo and Bujanovac.

So the Albanian's have been there longer, or for the same period and they form a majority in some areas. Why exactly should they go to another country? We may as well ask them to go to Australia. Lots of different ethnic groups have lived their together for long periods of time however it hasn't been in peace. That's why federations like Yugoslavia have failed and that's why we have the term "Balkanisation" - the creation of smaller states. If Serbia had the right to leave Yugoslavia, and the right to leave the Republic of Serbia and Montenegro why doesn't Kosovo (90% Albanian) have the right to leave Serbia? They're tired of being treated like second class citizens by the government (that includes being massacred). Serbia's not really losing anything, it's not like Kosovo is lying on a bed of oil. Following Serbia's own logic that Balkanisation will lead to peace they should just accept this is better for the Serbs and the Albanians and means we're less likely to see a repeat of the Kosovan Wars.

[Corporate Ignorance]

No offense, but Serbs aren't likely to give a very balanced opinion of their Albanian neighbours are they? The vast, vast majority of Albanian's do not "Rape, mob and kill" Serbs. In fact, most of the crime in Serbian is committed by Serbs.

But that's not the point.

Albanian's have lived in the area now called Kosovo since the Bronze Age. They were the first settlers to that area. The Slavs, Serbs, Croats, Hungarians and Slovenes came later, around the 7th Century BC. They were part of the Byzantine empire. Since then we've had various Kingdoms (Kingdom of Serbia, Kingdom of Yugoslavia), The Socialist Republic, The Federated Republic and finally The Republic of Serbia. Under all of these Serbs, Bosniaks, Roma's, Yugoslavs, Slovenes and Albanians have lived together. For hundreds of years. It IS their country. In some cities Albanian's make up a majority - like Kosovo, Presevo and Bujanovac.

So the Albanian's have been there longer, or for the same period and they form a majority in some areas. Why exactly should they go to another country? .

To my mind, situation is much more complicated then this...With independent Kosovo the geopolitical balance may be seriously shifted...Again, I rasie the problem of double standards..In some situations, when it's profitable, powerful countries act in one way, according to international law, with all that high rethoric about humans rights and right of self-determination.
In other cases, when their intrests are involved they act in direct violation of any moral and juridical accords or laws. And that is what we should always keep in mind.
Again, let us remmeber Kurds, who just don't even have the right to speak their own langauge, who are deprived of their national identety and are supressed with utmost brutaltity...But noone gives a shit, and T.V. is silent...So what about Northen Ireland...? As far as I know, Tatcher was far from compassion when crushing the IRA in 80s...
What about Cyprus?
What about Abhaziya?
What about Spain?

We shoud not be hypocrites and should appy to the same criterias to others as we apply to ourselves...
So, if you want to save Albanians, remmeber that Kurds are repressed FAR more badly and within borders of NATO who carried "humanitarion intervention"in 1999 while far more terrible things were happening right within its boundaries....But it wasn't covered in the mainstream media... And I know of what I'm speaking about, it's not just shit talk. Just do some research on the matter.

So, Milosovec was a criminal, absolutley no doubts...Saddam was a criminal, BUT...if we look into historical context of both of those matters we will understand what is really behind it all...


Again, I want to say that it's not like Evil Serbs slaughtering innocent, harmless Albanians...
Situation is complex, with lots of hatreds and Serbs are being also quite mistreated in the process..
I'm not advocating any side, what puzzles and angries me is the official stance of many rich and powerful states- if you are up to moral principles let us apply them in Middle East, East Timor, Iraq, Afghnanistan, Chechnya, Kosovo, Serbia, Turkey, U.S. or Britain. And if one applies certain high moral criterias only in Kosovo, and then in other part of the world acts in directly the opposite way, it does mean that it's just a foul play...

The thing is that both sides have their hands in blood, and I can say that both Serbs and Albanians suffered greatly during 1999 Kosovo War and what happened in the region aftewards until the present day...

[enigma]

So what about Northen Ireland...? As far as I know, Tatcher was far from compassion when crushing the IRA in 80s...
And? So what?

They were a terrorist organisation killing and maiming innocent people for no real course.

The south dont officially support them, in fact the original IRA accepted the peace terms back in the 20s which brought about two countires. The south dont want the north to be part of there country, we dont want the south to be part of ours (not because we hate each other or anything).

[2ltben]

You could try and solve this through referendum and self-determination voting, but no, of course not, fight it out in the streets. Its not like that sort of thing could have gone a long way to forestall WWII or anything, no of course not. Its not like a sovereign nation can choose to create a Federal state of Kosovo or something, that's just ridiculous.

The last thing the Balkans needs is another nation.

[Fallschirmjäger]

You are trying to tell me that the Albanians are the victims? Come on, you know better. It is a war of cultures, and since the world is blatantly blind for the injustice to the Serbians people, i really do hope they declare war and chease them back to Albania, where they belong.

Well no friends from kosovo,and what you say sounds right,but i just have not liked the serbs in these conflicts in the balkans and going back in history too.Like im not muslim,catholic etc...not relgious at all,dont know any of the sides at all in person.

I just have sided with the slovene's,croatia and bosnian muslims/croatian's(even though fought each other too),and albanians in these conflicts on personal choice.Like massacres by the serbs in all the conflicts etc... helped too,and yes they had it done to them too in croatia,bosnia etc...
And a war,they would lose again i think if even tried it,there are more kosovians/albanians and nato etc...there to fight them.Serbia i think would not get involved too now after the other wars they lost.

[2ltben]

You forget that the war to decide this was already fought, but still, I'm torn between wanting Albanian self-sovereignty (if they really are treated as second-class citizens) and a desperate desire to reunify the Balkans for stabilization and eventual entry into the EU.

Say what you will about the European Union, that's the endgame as far as the Balkans is concerned. Free trade leads to real economic growth, real economic growth combined with education and social spending leads to liberalism, liberalism leads to Federalism and democracy (or rather, small-r republicanism). Unemployment won't be nearly as much a problem once Schengen is implemented.